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Om ondskans roll

Här utforskar vi det komplexa och ofta missförstådda konceptet av ondskan, dess ursprung och dess inverkan på mänskligheten.

Sammanfattning

  • Dr. Frank Turek diskuterar förhållandet mellan Gud och ondska i sitt föredrag "If God, Why Evil?" vid Michigan State University.

  • Han utforskar argumentet att ondska faktiskt är ett argument för Guds existens snarare än mot den, eftersom ondska presupponerar godhet.

  • Turek betonar att ondska inte visar på frånvaron av Gud i världen, utan frånvaron av Gud i våra liv, då människor själva är ansvariga för att föra ondska in i världen.

Höjdpunkter

  • Ondska är ett vanligt argument som används för att ifrågasätta Guds existens.

  • Dr. Frank Turek föreslår att ondska faktiskt bekräftar existensen av Gud, eftersom ondska förutsätter godhet.

  • Han påpekar att ondska inte visar frånvaron av Gud i världen, utan att vi människor är ansvariga för att föra ondska in i världen.

📚 Teologi och problemet med ondska 🌍 Diskussion om Guds existens och ondska 🤔 Ondska som ett argument för Guds existens

Reflektionsfrågor

  1. Ondska som ett Argument för Guds Existens: Hur förändrar Dr. Frank Tureks argument ditt perspektiv på förhållandet mellan ondska och Guds existens? Tror du att ondska faktiskt kan vara ett argument för, snarare än mot, Guds existens?

  2. Ondska och Godhet: Dr. Turek menar att ondska förutsätter godhet. Vad menar du med det? Kan det finnas ondska utan godhet, eller är de två sidor av samma mynt?

  3. Människans Roll i Ondskan: Enligt Dr. Turek är människor själva ansvariga för att föra ondska in i världen. Hur ser du på detta? Är det en rimlig förklaring, eller finns det andra faktorer som också spelar in?

Tillämpningsfråga

  • Personligt Ansvar: Om vi accepterar Dr. Tureks argument att ondska i världen beror på människors val, hur kan vi då personligen bidra till att minska ondska och främja godhet i våra egna liv och i samhället i stort?

Transkribering av videon

00:02 [Music] good morning ladies and gentlemen some of you have watched your loved ones die some of you have buried children some of you have seen your jobs vanish your fortunes vanish some of you have been victims of sexual abuse maybe even right now some of you have been victims of divorce or abandonment or addictions and in every case you prayed that god would spare you of this and he said no my question is where was god why didn't he spare you why didn't he


01:07 keep your child alive or your spouse alive why did you lose your job why did they run out on you is it possible that the god that we pray to actually does not exist why would he put us through this and if he does exist maybe he's evil that's what richard dawkins the famous atheist said in his book the god delusion he said the god of the old testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all of fiction jealous and proud of it a petty unjust unforgiving control freak a vindictive bloodthirsty ethnic


02:01 cleanser a misogynistic homophobic racist infanticidal genocidal filicidal pestilential meglo maniacal sado ke masochistic capriciously malevolent bully and those are his good qualities i mean if this god did exist why would you worship him i mean what's his business about god killing the canaanites i mean really either the god that we worship doesn't exist or he's evil that's what dawkins is saying sorry for that cheery opening but ladies and gentlemen what if your best arguments to doubt god show that he


02:49 actually exists what if your best arguments or reasons to doubt god show that he actually exists because i think that's exactly what's going on here i think when atheists are arguing against god they're actually stealing from god when they're arguing against him and they do it in several ways in fact there's an acronym crimes that we have in our book stealing from god and i think atheists claim that many of the things represented by these letters point to atheism when my contention is none of these things would exist unless


03:26 god existed they include causality reason information morality evil and science atheists say these things show atheisms true in reality these things show that god exists you say how can that be well we unpack it in the book stealing from god we can't go through it all here this morning obviously we're just going to zero in on one issue the issue of evil we're gonna ask the question if god exists why is there evil and we're gonna try and do it in three steps first step is does evil disprove god because you hear people saying


03:58 there's too much evil in the world so there can't be a good god the second question we're going to try and answer is if evil does not disprove god what purpose is evil why does god leave it around why does he allow it to continue what purpose could he have for allowing evil and then the final question is what's god's solution to evil now i need to warn us all about one thing in here today and that is evil is not just a problem for the head but it's also a problem for the heart so if you're going through a lot of pain


04:33 and suffering right now what i might say this morning might not resonate with you you don't need a philosopher you need a pastor when you're going through difficulty and unfortunately pastor mike is on break right now so i'm the philosopher but i will say this that if you're going through pain and suffering the first step to recovery is for you to intellectually understand that god has a reason for the pain and suffering you're going through even if you never find out this side of eternity


05:04 what that reason or reasons are so what i'm going to try and do is give you some reasons why it might be happening but the first question we're going to answer is does evil disprove god are you guys ready to go there's a few more than the nine o'clock but still not very good all right so let's start here whenever you you're talking about a big issue like this i think you need to get the big picture you need to go up to 30 000 feet and look around and in order to do this we're going to list


05:39 evidence that god exists on the left and evidence he doesn't on the right okay now i don't have time to actually defend all the evidence i'm going to put up here i'm just going to draw conclusions we did it actually some of this we did in the women's conference this weekend how many people were at the women's conference or were somewhere else at the time all right how many of you are here right now all right how many don't respond to surveys [Music] three out of ten don't respond to


06:10 surveys okay i'm just going to list them okay they're in the books if you want to go into detail first evidence god exists the beginning of the universe space time and matter had a beginning out of nothing even atheists are admitting this well if space time and matter had a beginning out of nothing whatever created space time and matter can't be made a space timing matter in other words the cause must transcend space time and matter cause must be spaceless timeless immaterial powerful personal and intelligent sounds like god doesn't


06:38 it yes the fine-tuning of the universe the universe is so fine-tuned in so many parameters that if you were to change any one of them just imperceptibly we wouldn't be here it looks like somebody designed this universe also the information found in dna and every one of your 40 trillion cells there's a software program 3.


06:59 2 billion letters long all the letters are in the right order i don't know about you when i see software when i see a program i know there must be a programmer if there's design there must be a designer also life itself appears to be design consciousness and free will the very ability that we can ascertain truths about the real world that we have the freedom to make choices is better explained by god than it is explained by molecules bumping into one another which is what atheists believe in fact many atheists today deny there's free will


07:31 they deny there's consciousness in fact daniel dennett one of the famous atheists said that consciousness is an illusion one wonders if he was conscious when he said that also intelligence and reason the ability we have to reason that we can get outside of our skulls and ascertain truths about the real world and then draw valid conclusions about the real world our minds work not because they're put together by non-intelligent processes but because they're made in the image of the great mind also the laws of nature do you ever ask


08:06 yourself why are the laws of nature so precise and consistent why do they exist at all the laws of nature do you know that everything physical changes but the laws that govern everything that's physical don't change at least they don't appear to why is that because the universe was put together by a mind and it's sustained by a mind right now an order also objective morality the idea that certain things are right and other things are wrong murder's wrong love is right if there's no god that's just your


08:38 opinion against say hitler's opinion there's got to be a standard beyond us that grounds what true rightness or goodness is and unless god exists there's no such thing yet we know that goodness and truth exists and righteousness exists so god must exist also old testament prophecy and the resurrection and other miracles in the new testament that i think you can show by historical investigation really happen this is good evidence that god exists and it's the christian god what's the evidence that god doesn't


09:09 exist the biggest piece of evidence people say is evil there's too much evil in the world so there can't be a good god now is evil an argument against god at least three people say no actually no evil is actually an argument for god why because objective evil presupposes objective good and objective good requires god you say what do you mean because evil does not exist on its own evil only exists as a lack in a good thing evil is like cancer if you take all the cancer out of a good body you got a better body what happens if you


09:48 take all the body out of the cancer it doesn't exist can't exist evil is like rust in a car if you take all the rust out of a car you got a better car what happens if you if you try and take all the car out of the rust doesn't exist evil can only exist as a parasite in a good thing a totally moth eaten garment is a hanger it doesn't exist so while evil is real it can only exist in a good thing and if it can only exist in a good thing then goodness exists as the essential part of reality and any


10:23 deviation from goodness or what would be what we would call evil now this was not lost on c.s lewis c.s lewis was an atheist early on in his life because he went through world war one the terrible war and for a while he thought there can't be a good god because there's too much injustice in the world and then one day he had an epiphany and he wrote it in the book mere christianity how many people in here have read mere christianity okay if you haven't read mere christianity consider yourself undereducated you need to read


10:52 mere christianity and here's what lewis said about that in the book mere christianity basically that evil requires good and good requires god here's how he put it he said and as an atheist my argument against god was that the universe seems so cruel and unjust but how have i got this idea of just and unjust a man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line what was i comparing this universe with when i called it unjust you see there can't be a crooked line unless you know what a straight line is


11:22 you wouldn't know what injustice was unless you knew what justice was something can't be immoral unless something is something can't be not right unless something is and that presupposes god otherwise everything's just a matter of opinion so evil does not disprove god it may show there's a devil out there but it can't disprove god you could look at it this way as well the shadows prove the sunshine in order to have shadows you have to have sunshine in other words in order to have evil you have to have good oh you


11:55 can have sunshine without shadows you can have good without evil but you can't have shadows without sunshine you can't have evil without good if evil exists and everybody knows it does then god must exist because if there is no god there that means there is no good which means there is no evil and even richard dawkins the famous atheist i quoted a minute ago actually agrees that if there's no god there's no right or wrong there's no good or bad there's no just or unjust in fact here's here's his famous quote on


12:27 this he says if atheistic materialism is true in other words if we're just all moist robots there is no spiritual realm everything that happens just happens through the laws of physics here's what he says he says in a universe of blind physical forces and genetic replication some people are going to get lucky and other people are going to get or some people are going to get hurt and other people are going to get lucky and you won't find any rhyme or reason nor any justice there is at the bottom no design no


12:55 purpose no evil and no good nothing but blind pitiless indifference dna neither knows knows nor cares dna just is and we dance to its music if he's right you're just like a coke can fizzing you're not really a sentient being you're just a molecular machine and there's no good there's no bad there's no justice there's no right there's no wrong now wait a minute you might be thinking wait wait isn't this the same guy that just said this notice right in the middle of this quote


13:25 he called god unjust he just got done telling us there is no justice wait a minute you can't have it both ways where is he getting this concept of unjustice from he's stealing it from god he has to sit in god's lap to slap his face on one hand he's saying there's no justice on the other hand he's saying the god of the bible is unjust you can't have it both ways you know there's justice and unjustice so god must exist so to sum this up the existence of evil doesn't indicate the absence of god from the world but


13:59 the absence of him from our lives we're the ones that brought evil into this world and now we're paying the price so let's go back to our two column chart right here evil should actually not be on the right side we need to move evil over to the other side because evil is actually an argument for god not an argument against god but we're still left with the question okay it doesn't disprove god but what's the purpose of evil then god hasn't ended it why does he allow it to continue probably about 15 years ago i was at


14:35 michigan state university we go to colleges and we do i don't have enough faith to be in atheist presentations and i was going through the i don't have enough faith to be an atheist presentation at michigan state and there was a militant atheist in the audience and i knew he was a militant atheist in the audience because he sat through the entire two-hour presentation looking like this i mean he didn't crack a smile once and i had some pretty good jokes in there anyway as soon as i was done speaking i


15:06 said are there any questions and his hand shot up over here and i said yes sir and he said if there is a good god why doesn't he stop all the evil in the world i said sir that is an excellent question maybe because if he did he might start with you and me because we do evil every day do you ever notice when we complain about evil we're always complaining about somebody else hey god why don't you stop him hey god why don't you stop her we never say god why don't you stop me because if god wanted to stop evil he


15:37 might just start with me he might just start with you in fact if god were to stop evil tonight at midnight would you still be alive at 1201 i wouldn't be so i said actually sir that is a really good question and we could take semesters to talk about it but we don't have semesters so i have a way of of showing you a lot in a short period of time via this one minute and 46 second video it's not going to answer the problem completely but it'll give you a good doorway to an answer so i showed him this video and


16:11 i'm going to show it to you right now okay same video i showed at michigan state it's one minute and 46 seconds you've got to pay attention a lot going on you ready here we go is god good if he is why is there suffering and evil let's assume for the moment that god is all-powerful this means that god can do anything that is logically possible so he can create galaxies and subatomic particles and rainforests and you but god cannot do what is logically impossible he cannot make a square circle or a one-ended stick so can god make a


16:51 rock so big that he can't lift it no so what if when god created human beings he wanted them to be free freedom's a good thing but if humans are to be free they cannot be forced to obey god because freedom without choice is like a square circle it's a logical contradiction no choice no freedom god didn't want robots he wanted real people the first humans endowed with the awesome power of free choice abuse their freedom the tragic consequences of their bad choice and our bad choices ripple across the world


17:37 god is responsible for the fact of freedom but humans are responsible for their acts of freedom but let's remember we don't suffer alone god will put an end to suffering and evil and god became a man to suffer with us god is good and he wants real people like you to know him but the free choice is yours now if you want to see videos like that on our website crossexamine.


18:13 org you can see some also our youtube channel two words cross-examine that particular video was put together by a friend of mine jim zangmeister who went to our our seminary in charlotte southern evangelical seminary and he's made a number of those if you type in is god good in youtube you'll find that and there's a bunch of other ones that he's done for dr william lane craig you can find them on his website anyway the main point of that video as you saw is that evil exists because we have free will which is the only way that love


18:41 could exist so god gives us free will so we could love but it also opens up the possibility for evil and we do do evil we sin now after i showed that video how do you think the atheist looked he uh he looked uh like this he said okay i can see how free will has something to do with it but that can't explain everything what about babies why do babies die they didn't do anything wrong there's no free will there i said sir in order for us to figure out why a particular thing happened in life we have to know what the purpose of life


19:16 is because you can't know the purpose of a particular thing in life unless you know what the overall purpose of life is so since i had just gone through the evidence that christianity was true that the bible was true i asked the audience what's the purpose of life so what is the purpose of life this is the interactive portion of the program what is the purpose of life i hear people say glorify god where's that in the bible that's the westminster confession i mean it's true i'm just saying where


19:51 would you go scripturally to point that out i think one of the clearest ways of pointing out what the purpose of life is is what jesus prayed in his high priestly prayer in john 17 when he's praying about us the believers and here's what he says as he's praying to the father this is eternal life that they meaning us may know you the only true god in jesus christ whom you've sent the purpose of life is to know god and to make him known not just intellectually right james the half brother of jesus who


20:22 wrote that little book in the new testament called you guys are sharp this morning he says even the demons know that god exists but they tremble do you realize the demons know that god exists better than we do but they don't trust in him they just know it intellectually they don't repent they can't they're fixed but we can repent we can know god in a relational way and then we can make him known the second half of this of course is the great commission matthew 28 19 go therefore make disciples of all nations notice he


20:54 didn't say make believers make disciples so the purpose of life is to know god grow in god and make god known here's the problem knowing and growing in god often requires pain c.s lewis put it so well he said that god whispers to us in our pleasure speaks in our conscience but shouts in our pains it is his megaphone to arouse a deaf world sometimes you only look up when you're on your back you're not interested in god until something goes wrong and then suddenly you go oh maybe i don't have it all together this is why


21:32 jesus said it's difficult for a rich man to get into heaven why did he say that because when you're rich you think you can control everything and then as soon as you realize you can't then suddenly maybe god becomes more real to you now thankfully he didn't say it was impossible for a rich man to get into heaven because if that were the case none of us would make it according to america according to the world we're we're all rich here in america and of course the scriptures talk about


21:56 the value of pain and suffering james says my brethren count it all joy when you fall into various trials question ladies and gentlemen how many people counted all joy when you get into various trials crickets right i want to get out of it don't you he says you got to do this because your testing of your faith produces patience you you become more like jesus when you go through this paul in romans 5 says we also glory in tribulation how many people in here glory and tribulation can i see your hands please you're a liar if


22:26 your hands up none of us do but that's what paul says glory and tribulation knowing the tribulation produces perseverance and perseverance character and character hope we need difficulty in our lives we need people to say no we need trouble we need obstacles if not how do we how do we become in fact let me ask you this what would happen to you if you got everything you wanted every time i know i would become even more of a more moral monster than i already am if i got everything i wanted all the time i mean what do we call kids who get


23:03 everything they want spoiled what makes them spoiled what's spoiled their character is spoiled if you want to ruin a kid just give him everything he wants you will ruin them you need difficulty you need people to say no you need trouble to come in your life if you don't you're not going to become more like jesus you're going to become more like a demon like a self-entitled celebrity if he doesn't get his water at 41.


23:32 6 degrees he's pitching a hissy fit and in fact if you think about this some virtues can only be developed through evil and trial it's really hard to develop courage unless there's danger it's hard to develop perseverance without obstacles hard to develop compassion unless someone is suffering it's really hard to get patients without tribulation now i'm a very impatient person and i've been praying for patients for quite a while and frankly i'm getting tired of waiting for it by the way never pray for patience


24:07 what's going to happen if you do everything will go wrong all week no character without adversity and no faith meaning trust without need if you think you've got it all squared away and you don't need anybody you're not going to trust in god you're going to think that you're going to do it your own way you know the problem with the self-made man is that he worships his creator that's the problem we need difficulty we need trouble and i know it's going to sound trite but it's true no pain no gain actually


24:47 that's uh that doesn't go far enough the real truth is more pain more gain and this is what paul says in second corinthians 4 he's wrapping up a little section on suffering and here's how he wraps it up he says for our light and momentary troubles here on this earth are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all so we fix our eyes not on what is seen but on what is unseen for what is seen as temporary but what is unseen is eternal in other words the difficulty you go through here enhances your


25:17 capacity not only to enjoy god now but also in eternity now it's hard to communicate this in an analogy but i'll give you kind of a trite analogy since most of us understand sports in here um i'll give you a sports analogy that i think this is communicating i grew up in new jersey forget about it so i grew up as a new york giant fan and in 2004 the new york giants traded with the san diego chargers to get eli manning number one in the draft and the first few years in new york he wasn't very good


25:50 and in fact when your name is manning your brother is payton you're selected number one and you're not very good and you're playing in new york you're gonna hear it right so he took a lot of grief his first few years and then in 2007 he had a pretty good year he got his team to the playoffs and then he wound up beating three favorite teams on the road to get to the super bowl one of those favorite teams he beat on the road was the hated dallas cowboys in fact we have a saying in new jersey it goes like this


26:23 whenever the cowboys win it's living proof that satan is alive and well the problem was eli and the giants were going up against the 18-0 new england patriots who already had a book 19-0 written all they had to do was put the final score on the last page they were going to be the the greatest team of all time they were favored by 12 points the only people that picked the giants were the giants in fact before the game in the media day they went up to plexigo burris who was a receiver for the giants and said flexico


26:58 what's going to be the final score and plexigo said we're going to win 21 to 17. and then the media guy went over to tom brady and said plexico said the giants are going to win 21-17 and all brady said was oh we're only going to score 17 points okay because they had set records that year for scoring points so he thought that was a ridiculous prediction anyway then they actually played the game giants had a really good defense they've sacked brady five times which he didn't like turns out it's a pitchers duel two


27:33 minutes to go patriots ahead 14-10 eli has to take his team 80 yards to win he's about to go down under a sure sack because he's normally a statue back there but somehow he spins out of the sack he throws a hail mary pass over the middle of the field and it's caught by a guy by the name of david tyree who pins it up against his helmet and if you remember this place some of you are old enough to remember this and uh he walked off the field they have all this on video this guy happened to be a christian he walked off the field and he


28:02 said hey man this is supernatural and then he didn't catch another pass the rest of his nfl career okay a couple of plays later manning hits barris the guy who predicted the score in the end zone with 35 seconds to go the giants win 17-14 the patriots don't even score 17 points and tom brady was deflated some of you will get that tomorrow and then eli and the giants beat the patriots four years later again now what's the point of all this after the super bowl eli held up the lombardi trophy and so did the third string quarterback


28:51 who hardly played it down all year but question did eli enjoy the celebration more of course he did why because he'd been in the game the whole time the whole season the whole career he was told he couldn't do it he played through injuries he played through difficulty he played through people who said he he could never win the big game so by going through all the difficulty he actually enhanced his capacity to enjoy the reward when it came the third string quarterback who hadn't been in the game or any of the games most of the year was


29:21 he was happy to be there but he didn't enhance his capacity enough to really enjoy it as much as eli that's what goes on here when you go through difficulty you're enhancing your soul you're growing your soul when you get everything what you want you're shrinking it and this is what i think paul is saying that our light and momentary afflictions are achieving for us a greater glory that far outweighs them all and when you go through difficulty it will lead to a greater good in fact this is what the scriptures say that


29:53 suffering will bring a greater good paul actually says this in romans 8 he says and we know that all things work together for good to those that love god to those who are called according to his purpose notice how he doesn't say all things are good no there's a lot of evil out there he's saying that all things work together for good so when somebody says why do babies die well i can say i don't know i know why babies die in general because we live in a fallen world i mean imagine this imagine if you couldn't


30:32 you're indestructible till age 70. imagine imagine if that were the case i don't know about you but i think we'd be incredibly reckless until 69 years and 11 months right and then we go i guess we got to get serious about this thing right no we live in a fallen world i know why there's evil and i know why people die now but if you're going to ask me why does a particular baby die i don't know why that particular baby dies but i know why i don't know why because i'm finite i'm inside of time and god is


31:06 outside of time he can see the end from the beginning he can see how we can all work together now after i explained all this at michigan state how do you think the atheist looked he uh he looked like this he said that doesn't explain it all okay i can see how some evil can lead to good i can get but there's some evil out there that has absolutely no good that results from it it's what philosophers call gratuitous evil there's no good that can ever come from it so i said sir how could you know that


31:38 you'd have to be god to know that now it is true if life just ends at the tomb yeah there is a lot of evil that probably has no ultimate good to it there's no justice right there are many people that go to the grave who have committed crimes that have never been punished many rights are not wronged there are many goods that never arrive because if life ends at the grave it's not there's no resolution but what if life doesn't end at the grave what if it goes beyond the grave then what this is what paul's saying we need to


32:19 have an eternal perspective i've been struggling with evil the question of evil for a long time until i discovered one thing called the ripple effect what's the ripple effect that everything that happens today ripples forward into the future to affect billions if not trillions of other events in fact think of the ripple effect in your own life i mean let's just think about your parents your parents had to meet for you to be here and then their parents had to meet for them to be here and you to be here and then their parents had to me


32:51 think about all the ripples that went into you sitting here right now some of those ripples were good some of those ripples were bad but god can bring good from evil even when we can't see it why does a particular baby die now i don't know but i know why i don't know why maybe a particular baby dying now ripples forward into the future to somehow create 500 years from now a great evangelist who saves millions of people that baby dying contributed to that great evangelist i can't see that i'm not i'm inside of time but god can


33:32 see the end from the beginning this is why he can bring good from evil even when we can't see it this is the ripple effect now the bible talks about the ripple effect but not in these words in fact you remember joseph from the old testament joseph is sold into slavery by his brothers who don't like him because he's dad's favorite and then he winds up in egypt and he's falsely accused in egypt but then somehow he works his way into prominence in egypt and he puts a lot of grain aside and then his family many years


34:02 later leave israel to escape a famine they come to egypt to escape the famine and as soon as joseph sees them as soon as he recognizes them these are the people his family that sold him into slavery what does he say you dirty rats you're going to pay for what you did to me no no he doesn't say that what does he say here's what he says you intended to harm me but god intended it for good to accomplish what is now being done the saving of many lives he could actually see the ripple effect the very people that did evil to joseph


34:35 that evil rippled forward to help them later now of course we don't do evil so that evil or good will result but sometimes god shows that to us showed it to us in this passage right here so the bottom line to the whole thing is that while respecting free choice god can bring good from evil even when we can't see it now when people often bring up this problem of god and evil they normally say this that god is all-loving and all-powerful if he's all-loving and all-powerful why does evil still exist what they say is


35:15 he's either not all loving or he's not all-powerful or he's neither because evil still exists but you know what people are forgetting when they try and say this yeah god is all loving yeah god is all-powerful they all also forget that god is all wise that god is all-knowing he can see the end from the beginning he can see how all the ripples come together one of the most profound things ever said on this topic was said by a roman catholic priest about 150 years ago at notre dame in in france in paris and


35:52 here's what he said about this issue he said if god would concede me his power for 24 hours you would see how many changes i would make in the world but if he gave me his wisdom too i would leave things as they are god knows the end from the beginning we don't ripples can go forward to places we have no concept of so when some something evil takes place and you go i can't see any good coming from this of course you can't see any good coming from it you're a speck in time god sees how it all works together


36:27 so i explained all that at michigan state we're still there and then about 10 feet from the atheist a man raised his hand so i said yes sir so he said i know of a woman who was raped and he looked over at the atheist and he looked back at me and he said this rape nearly destroyed this woman in fact she became pregnant as a result of the rape but she decided that she was not going to punish the baby for the sin of the father she decided to bring this baby to term and his voice started to crack and he said this baby was a boy


37:17 who grew up to be a man and actually became a pastor by this time he's crying in front of everybody and he said this pastor has led a lot of people to christ and has discipled a lot of people in christ and that pastor is me and then he looked over at the atheist and he said if my mom can bring good from evil so can god and i said you're dismissed i mean how could i add to that he had a better way of saying it than i did so how do you think the atheist looked after that he ran away he was gone literally that was it he ran


38:11 out the back door but i went to the pastor and i said what's your name he said my name is gary bingham i'm a pastor in marion indiana he had driven to lansing that night and he said um i'm a pastor up there and i said well how's your mom and he said well she's doing a lot better now than when she was because or then she was originally because four years ago she became a christian and i said well obviously what your mom did has rippled forward to bring so much good through you and it actually is even rippling forward


38:47 tonight because you just told that story to everybody else here and by the way it's rippling forward to this morning because i'm telling the story to you and it's also in the book stealing from god so it keeps rippling so what about god's solution to evil we know that evil does not disprove god we know that god has a purpose for evil what's god's ultimate solution before we get into this i need to ask you a question and here's the question does god promise to protect christians from evil and suffering


39:24 no here's a painting of peter being crucified upside down you know many of the apostles died brutal deaths for saying christianity was true when they could have said spare me it's not true in fact take a look at all of the people up here these biblical characters what is the common thread running through all these biblical characters all of these biblical characters have suffered tremendously some of them to the point of martyred them martyrdom including jesus who was the only innocent one up there why do we expect better treatment


39:59 than the perfect son of god god because you know there's people out there saying in the word of faith movement saying if you're not healthy and wealthy it's because you don't have enough faith that's easily disproven by one simple observation jesus and the apostles weren't healthy and wealthy don't tell me they didn't have enough faith i mean that's stupid to say if you don't have enough faith that's the reason you're not healthy and wealthy no we're not healthy and wealthy because


40:32 of sin we're not healthy and wealthy because we live in a fallen world and no you just can't have enough faith and decide you're going to heal everybody that's why pastor mike was up here a couple of weeks ago taking q a and he said you know there are no 300 year old pentecostals what do you mean by that well if you could if you had the power to heal everybody all the time why wouldn't you just do it to everybody including yourself grandma 612 years old you keep praying for it let her go to be with jesus knock


41:01 it off this is not heaven yet now don't get me wrong we ought to be praying for people to be healed but it's not in our power it's god's power one day this will be heaven though god's going to remake the heavens and the earth and we're going to have physical bodies resurrected bodies that won't break down but the question still remains what's god's solution to evil you know what god's solution to evil is he suffered himself he took evil upon himself you know the entire christian story is


41:39 the answer to the problem of evil that's what it is and it's the only worldview that can answer it that yes evil exists but god has entered the bloodstream of humanity to allow the people that that tortured him to be reconciled to him because he took their sin our sin on himself after living a perfect life so the solution to evil is jesus he takes it upon himself and his pain can be our gain i say can be why because if you don't want to accept what he's done you don't have to another invented michigan was the


42:18 university of michigan i was debating an atheist by the name of eddie tabash and eddie asked me this question during the an interactive portion of our debate he said frank my mother was a survivor of the holocaust she lived a life full of pain and suffering toward the end of her life somewhat offered her the gospel but she rejected it and then she died is she in hell right now pretty tough question so i said eddie i don't know where your mother is now i don't know if she had a deathbed conversion but if she didn't accept


42:53 jesus before she died then god is too loving to force her into heaven against her will you see the assumption behind the question is that everybody wants to go to heaven that is not true who's in heaven jesus is in heaven there have been people running from jesus their entire lives what's he going to do in the afterlife going hey where are you going get over here you're with me now how would that be loving you say what what's all this business about hell i used an analogy with the university of michigan audience i'll use


43:27 it with you as well this is a question for the ladies ladies here's the question ladies have you ever had a man pursue you whom you did not want to date some of you going yeah and he sitting next to me right now he will not leave me alone whenever i ask that question the ladies always giggle and the men look at their shoes is she looking at me right now well ladies suppose this man keeps asking you out he keeps asking you out and uh you're not really interested so you say look i like you but only as a ladies why don't you just stick the


44:09 knife in and turn it every man has heard the dreaded friend rejection gentlemen if you ever get the dreaded friend rejection move on she's not interested in fact i have some shocking news for you she doesn't even like you as a friend [Laughter] ladies am i right yeah you're just trying to be nice aren't you now if you if you liked him as a friend you'd be interested but you're not well suppose this doesn't deter this guy he keeps asking he keeps asking out and he finally says look i love you so much i'm


44:40 going to force you to love me ladies run screaming from the building can he do that can he force you to love him no love must be freely given so if he truly did love you if he truly did seek the best for you what would he do he would leave you alone that's what god does for us he sends us cards letters and flowers he sends us creation he sends us conscience he sends us christ he sends us the bible he sends us pastor mike and the entire team here he sends his compass bible church he may if you're a muslim in a far off land


45:13 even send you a dream or a vision and if you all say no no no i don't want you god will give you up to your own desire paul talks about this in romans 1 that if you suppress the truth long enough god's going to give you up and let you go your own way because that's what a loving being does he doesn't force himself on you and that's what hell is it's separation from god you say what could be so bad about separation from god well think about it this way everybody right now whether you're christian or


45:49 not you experience some of the common grace of god whether you're a christian or not you experience love relationships uh hope for a future you know as rain falls on the just and unjust we all experience some of this right but i want you to imagine a place where there is no love where there are no relationships where there is no hope where there is no future there's just stone cold narcissistic self-absorption that is washington [Laughter] actually that is hell you're a set and it's washington you're


46:31 separated from the ultimate source of goodness by your own choice and you don't want to be separated from the ultimate source of goodness god will leave you alone you'll be punished at the right level of punishment you deserve and you will be separated so the question is would a loving god send you to hell no you're going to send yourself there look you don't go to hell because you don't believe in jesus you go to hell because you've sinned to say like oh god's going to send me to hell because i don't believe in jesus no


47:06 that'd be like saying uh i die because i don't go to the doctor no it's you don't die because you don't go to the doctor you die because you have a disease now maybe going to the doctor can prevent you from dying but the reason you're dying is because you have a disease same thing is true with jesus the reason you're going to go to hell is because you're a sinner not because you haven't accepted jesus but if you do accept jesus if you do repent you're going to the great physician who


47:34 can prevent your eternal death c.s lewis put it best he said look in the end there's only two kinds of people those who say to god thy will be done and those to whom god says thy will be done so the bottom line to all this does evil disprove god no which actually shows god does exist because there'd be no such thing as evil unless there was good and there'd be no such thing as good unless god existed what's the purpose of evil god has many purposes many of them are to cause us to get better to become more


48:04 like jesus rather than more like the demons and god's solution to evil is he takes it upon himself and he offers it to us the free gift of salvation if we repent and want it now i went through this material very quickly if you want the entire powerpoint presentation to this text the word why evil not two words one word why evil no quotes on it to four four two two two i'm gonna send you a pdf for this entire powerpoint presentation so you can look at it at your leisure and then there are books in the bookstore i don't have enough faith


48:36 to be an atheist stealing from god in fact there's a dvd set out there called stealing from god which goes through this topic and all the other ones in crimes that i mentioned earlier so if you want to go further there you can and i want to point out that all the proceeds from the sale the books and the dvds will go to feed needy children mine okay just so you know all right so where was god when you go through difficulty where is he well originally he was hanging on a cross to take evil upon himself and then he proved


49:19 that he could do that because he rose from the dead so as the worship team comes let us pray that if any of us haven't accepted the free gift and have grown in christ that today would be the day we'd make a decision to do that heavenly father we pray if there's someone here who is not accepted your free gift that you provide us or if there's someone here who has not been in the game we've been sitting on the sidelines that today would be the day that they would decide to follow you wholeheartedly


50:05 we know that evil exists everywhere and you are the only answer to the problem of evil that's what the whole christian story is so give us the courage to do what is right to repent to accept what you've done and then to live as a disciple for him in this dark and dying world in the name of jesus who died for us amen [Music]



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